Hey All,

I’ve been thinking about the references to the pit mine being in a ravine. I don’t think it is, but I haven’t found it either – so what do I know? However, Conatser refers to the mine being in a ravine.

“The mine, which Waltzer described as being a cone shaped pit is supposedly situated in a ravine high on the side of a mountain with the mouth of the mine facing west. … Directly across the ravine and facing the east is a rock formation shaped like a face that looks down on the mine…. Also across the ravine from the mine there is a cave. On the hillside below the mine there is a horizontal shaft penetrating into the mountain. This uncompleted tunnel was supposedly started by the Mexicans when the pit above became too difficult to work.” ST Conatser, ‘The Sterling Legend’ page 30.

On page 31 Conatser writes:
In a north-south trending canyon “continue on down the canyon for a distance described as several miles, carefully observing the east side of the canyon. At an undetermined distance you will see a rock formation in the shape of a face high on a ridge. This is the key. Directly across from this stone face is the entrance to the mine.”

OK, now I’m confused. On page 31 I am observing the EAST side of the canyon to find a ‘face’ high on a ridge – therefore the face looks to the WEST.
But on page 30, I am looking to for a face that FACES EAST.

Are there two rock faces? I seriously doubt that is the case – especially in the same place.

There are multiple things I would like to discuss that Conatser wrote in these two short passages, but to keep things simple - for now my question is: are there TWO rock faces?

Thanks in Advance,
Ashton

Ashton,

The answer is simple. Ester Conatser got her North/South - East/West directions mixed up all the time. When listening to her speak I had to constantly interrupt her to clarify a direction she was talking about.

One of her biggest Boo-Boo's in her book was where she said that the LDM Jr. she found, was located SOUTH of the Tortilla Ranch. I spent a half of one summer looking for that location, before I finally found it almost Due EAST of Tortilla Ranch.

Directions were not among her strong points.

I would go by what she said on page 30 and ignore the conflicting info on page 31. A good Editor would have caught that error.

Hope this helps,

Best,

Jim

I noticed the same thing a couple times in her book where she got east/west goofed up. I'll post the one tonight that completely confused me - it's in the same section you are talking about Jim where she describes where the mine was that she found near Tortilla Ranch.

Gentlemen,

If I understand correctly, I have been following directions from someone who confuses north and south…… consistently. There’s gotta be a certain irony in that.

Oh well, on the bright side, at least she only confuses north with south and not with east and west. I think I’m going to get my son’s “pin the tail on the donkey” game out and put my map of the Superstitions on the wall – blindfold him, give him three spins and…….. OK, back to Conatser.

Because the stone face ‘across the ravine’ faces west - the ravine therefore runs N-S. The hillside is on the east of the canyon. Everybody with me so far? I’m not a hardrock miner, but I think that placing the pit mine DOWN IN the ravine is problematic because of the tunnel “on the hillside below the mine” that was intended to intersect the vertical pit mine.

The purpose of the horizontal tunnel was to make it easier to get to the vein and (to me anyway) tunneling under the side of a ravine is a lot of work. I don’t see that amount of work being less than simply digging the vertical shaft deeper.

What does make sense to me is if the mine is “across the ravine” from a stone face looking west, then the mine is UP ON the western side of the ravine and the horizontal tunnel is simply further below the mine on the same hillside. Right, wrong……… am I lost? Should I just get out “pin the tail on the donkey” game?

Thanks,
Ashton

You're lost..........

The CANYON runs N/S not the RAVINE.
The ravine runs E/W on the East side of the canyon.
The face is on the West side of the canyon and looks east across the canyon toward the mine.

I think she got it right on page 30 of her book.

From your post above;

“The mine, which Waltzer described as being a cone shaped pit is supposedly situated in a ravine high on the side of a mountain with the mouth of the mine facing west. … Directly across the ravine and facing the east is a rock formation shaped like a face that looks down on the mine…. Also across the ravine from the mine there is a cave. On the hillside below the mine there is a horizontal shaft penetrating into the mountain. This uncompleted tunnel was supposedly started by the Mexicans when the pit above became too difficult to work.” ST Conatser, ‘The Sterling Legend’ page 30.

Best,

Jim

She does confuse east and west too Ashton - I'll provide the quote tonight.

Thank you for that vote of confidence

Ashton

Gentlemen,

One of the things I’m trying to ascertain from Conatser’s point of view is if the mine is in the ravine -=or=- up on one of the ravine banks (that’s probably not the correct terminology) I mean up above, before where the ravine drops off – as opposed to being “down in” the ravine.

According to Conatser: “the Dutchman reportedly described it as being a chimney formation (deep and usually vertical) of rose quartz and about 18” wide with the gold occurring therein.” The Sterling Legend, pg 29. I'm pointing out that the mine is a vertical shaft.

There is the issue IF the ravine runs E-W (cutting into the mountain) and IF the (vertical) mine is down in the ravine – then the horizontal tunnel below, would also need to be in the ravine -=or=- it could be below where the ravine begins i.e. ‘on the hillside below’. IF that is the case, it would narrow the choice of possible locations.

Although I’m not convinced that Conatser’s ravine runs E-W because she refers to “Directly across the ravine and facing the east is a rock formation shaped like a face that looks down on the mine” (pg 30). If the rock formation FACES east it’s not going to be ‘directly across’ AND ‘looks down on the mine’ in a ravine that runs E-W.

Right? Wrong? Or am I completely lost at this point?

Best,
Ashton

Ashton,

Try to imagine the lay of the land with the landmarks like I have them positioned in the sketch below. If you can do that... Tho I didn't draw them in... The rest (Cave below the face and across the canyon from the mine, The tunnel below the shaft, and the setting sun shining into the mine, should all fit into place.

Best,

Jim

Hi Jim,

Doesn’t that place the intersecting horizontal tunnel down in the ravine and not on the hillside?

Thanks,
Ashton