THE "MERCURY MINE"

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djui5
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Re: THE "MERCURY MINE"

Post by djui5 » Mon Feb 01, 2010 8:57 pm

Jim Hatt wrote: The floor of the mine feels good and solid. If it was bulk-headed and back-filled. Who ever did it, did a real good job, and the layer of vegetation kept the loose dirt, from working it's way down through the bulk-head.

Jim

There is a trick in that trail, you have to go through a hole or cave to get to the mine. :shock:

Jim Hatt

Re: THE "MERCURY MINE"

Post by Jim Hatt » Mon Feb 01, 2010 9:10 pm

That's the one Randy! How did you know that?

The "Trick in the Trail" is a little upstream from the cave, from which you can look up from the entrance, and see a stone face looking East towards the opening of that mine, that faces West so the setting sun can shine right down into it. Did I forget to mention the walled up tunnel a short distance down the hillside from the mine?

NOT!


;)


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Re: THE "MERCURY MINE"

Post by djui5 » Tue Feb 02, 2010 10:48 pm

:lol: :lol: :lol:

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Re: THE "MERCURY MINE"

Post by oroblanco » Thu Feb 04, 2010 12:43 am

HOLA amigos,

I am speculating here but have seen similar things with the packed vegetation in the floor of very old mines; packrats make nests of sticks, twigs, rope etc and over time these are abandoned and with the result that water from rains washes in and carries in dirt that eventually buries the old nest. What would "seal the deal" would be if you were to find some rat droppings in the very bottom, practically UNDER the twigs.

That is quite an interesting find amigo, I had heard there was a mercury mine in the Superstitions but never found it. If you suspect that pack of vegetation might be just a "plug" as sometimes forms in old mines, rather than risk life and limb by stepping on it (and maybe falling through) you could make up a steel probe out of rebar; that is get a length of half inch (thicker would be better but then is just too danged heavy to pack) rebar, cut two pieces out of it, one being around six feet or so (shorter is okay) and another about two feet long then weld the short one on the end of the six footer. The other end of your "T" then you put on a grinder and sharpen it to a somewhat rounded point, not TOO sharp either or it can "stick" in the ground too much. If you have the patience it also helps to grind the whole length of the part you shove into the ground (the long leg of the T) so that it is fairly smooth otherwise the rough pattern on the rebar tends to grab the dirt and can be tough to pull it out. To use it, just push it in with your hands, wiggle it some every few inches and push some more etc DON'T hammer on it or you will be leaving it there forever. If that turns out to be a "plug" you will quickly find out as it will suddenly get much easier or almost fall as you are pushing so be careful doing this.

Mercury has been bringing some pretty fancy prices recently, it might be worth working that mine if it were legally feasible.

One more thing, the gold mine of Apache Jack was mentioned; I am fairly convinced this was quite a different mine from the one of Jacob Waltz, based on his description of the ore itself; he said it was black quartz with spots of gold showing "...like stars in the sky" which is unlike the known specimens of Waltz's ore. Being black in color is also indicative of a different type of gold lode deposit, as this color most commonly occurs (in Arizona) in what are called "Epithermal" veins, that is they are formed at very shallow or near-surface deposits, while Waltz's ore has the hallmarks of a vein formed at great depth, called a "Hypothermal" vein. I may be mistaken of course, having never found either Waltz's mine nor the one Apache Jack spoke of, just judging by the ore description compared to what we see from old Jacob.

Thank you for sharing this Jim, really cool photos and story, my compliments!
Roy ~ Oroblanco

Jim Hatt

Re: THE "MERCURY MINE"

Post by Jim Hatt » Thu Feb 04, 2010 5:02 am

I'm hoping you will get down here someday Roy, and we can go together, and give that mine a good inspection, close up and personal.

I have already prodded the floor with a 4' rod. There are hard spots (like rocks) in it, but if I move 6-8" it is soft again. I have driven the rod in the full 4' in many places. If it IS bulkheaded and backfilled. There was a lot of manpower spent on doing it!

Jim

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Re: THE "MERCURY MINE"

Post by steveevh5150 » Sun Feb 21, 2010 10:32 am

Jim,

How are ya? This is the Ohioan :) Finally glad to get my first post in here!! The images you have of your "Mercury Mine" are really cool indeed. Just looking at the pictures, they just seem to say there's something more to the story there. What really gets my mind going is the idea of those mats and the possibility of that mine being backfilled. When I was in the Marines, we were down in Manila in the Philippines. We had a couple days off so a few of us went down to see where they had all the diggings for Yamashita's gold. There were mines there that they gave us a tour of. There were a few that were backfilled in a similar way. They told us that the gold was taken out of there during WWII but, I didn't really understand why they went through the trouble of backfilling the mines if there were nothin in the them. I guess my point is that they had carts of dirt and gravel hauled in to fill them back up. Could this be the case with your Mercury Mine? In any of your search of the surrounding area did you see any uprooted areas or old depressions where they might have dug up extra stone to haul in there and conceal something?? Thanks,
Steve

Jim Hatt

Re: THE "MERCURY MINE"

Post by Jim Hatt » Sun Feb 21, 2010 10:42 am

Hello Steve, and welcome to the forums.

This mine is in very rough terrain. No way anybody could use carts of any kind. You couldn't even get them in there. The sloping ground below the mine is so, steep that everything is constantly migrating downhill with every rain. Any existing holes would be filled in pretty quick by erosion from above.

Jim

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Re: THE "MERCURY MINE"

Post by gollum » Thu Mar 18, 2010 12:38 pm

I WONDER....................

If you read the diaries of Father Kino SJ and Capt Juan Mateo Manje (the entrada of 1697), it talks about them seeing a rich ledge of very red cinnabar, and an Indian came to them with some of the red clay wrapped in a piece of cloth. When he held it, Manje claimed the ball of clay weighed MUCH more than it should have, and when he squeezed it, quicksilver dropped out.

Capt. Manje made a note of the location, but no mention was ever made of him going back for it. I don't remember all the details, but there was a paper written called "Manje's Mercury Mine." I see it is available on JSTOR, but I don't have access to it.

If anything from that mine could be dated to the late 17th Century it may prove that Kino and Manje WERE actually in the Supers.

Best-Mike

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Re: THE "MERCURY MINE"

Post by gollum » Thu Mar 18, 2010 12:40 pm

I say that, because the 1697 Entrada was the one that took them to Casa Grande.

Best-Mike

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Re: THE "MERCURY MINE"

Post by cubfan64 » Thu Mar 18, 2010 1:52 pm

gollum wrote:I say that, because the 1697 Entrada was the one that took them to Casa Grande.

Best-Mike
Mike, have a copy of this article if you're interested:

Father Kino's 1697 Entrada to the Casa Grande Ruin in Arizona: A Reconstruction
Author(s): Ronald L. Ives
Source: Arizona and the West, Vol. 15, No. 4 (Winter, 1973), pp. 345-370
Published by: Journal of the Southwest

It references Manje's Mercury Mine, but it doesn't place it in the Superstitions at all.

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