Are the stone Maps Authentic or are they a Hoax?

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Re: Are the stone Maps Authentic or are they a Hoax?

Post by gollum » Sun Jun 10, 2012 9:57 pm

babymick1 wrote:Mike

The thing with your hole line of thinking is why would Travis haul the stones all the way from oregon to az just to give them a car wash. Not to sell them, Not to profit from them, Not to suck in investors, Just drive thier and then head back home. Makes no CENTS. Travis was a good man, thought maybe he found something good. Told the truth so people could call him a lier when he passed.
Wait that last thought makes only cents to you. He found them like he said.
So stop trash talking Travis.

Babymick1
Maybe you should learn to read before you direct any statements towards me. Did you personally know Travis Tumlinson? I highly doubt it. I have personally spoken with his daughter. Have you? I highly doubt it. I have spoken with two other people that personally knew the Tumlinsons. Have you? Well...... you know......

I have personally held and was permitted to privately examine the stone maps (see my avatar, does that look a little like the Horse/Priest Stone?). Have you ever been anywhere near them? There only a very few people that have spent as much time as I have researching the history of the stone maps (I give huge credit to Azmula, Garry, and Larry).

Do you have ADD or ADHD? Do you have reading comprehension problems? Reread my posts and PLEASE quote me showing where I said that Travis had ever tried to sell the stones. Go back to about 2006 and see what I have been saying about Travis Tumlinson. You might want to reread even my more recent posts. I have ALWAYS been one of a very few people that gave Travis T the benefits of any doubts, and I have NEVER called him a liar (spelled correctly). I have only said that since I didn't personally know the man, I can't say for 100% certain that he didn't lie about anything he said. CAN YOU? See, when you are intellectually honest, unless you know something beyond a shadow of a doubt (like Travis T's integrity), you have to admit the possibility of a lie. If you don't admit the possibility, then you A. have some knowledge we don't, B. are deluded by what you hope, or C. just plain stupid.

So in summation, before you try and smack talk me, you NEED to get your facts straight and keep your posts civil. It will save you from public humiliation and possibly pain. :oops: ;)

Mike

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Re: Are the stone Maps Authentic or are they a Hoax?

Post by babymick1 » Mon Jun 11, 2012 8:15 am

gollum wrote:
babymick1 wrote:Mike

The thing with your hole line of thinking is why would Travis haul the stones all the way from oregon to az just to give them a car wash. Not to sell them, Not to profit from them, Not to suck in investors, Just drive thier and then head back home. Makes no CENTS. Travis was a good man, thought maybe he found something good. Told the truth so people could call him a lier when he passed.
Wait that last thought makes only cents to you. He found them like he said.
So stop trash talking Travis.

Babymick1
Maybe you should learn to read before you direct any statements towards me. Did you personally know Travis Tumlinson? NO, DIED BEFORE I WAS BORN have personally spoken with his daughter. YES, I CALL HER MOM I have spoken with two other people that personally knew the Tumlinsons. YES, AND MANY MORE

I have personally held and was permitted to privately examine THE FAKE stone maps (see my avatar, does that look a little like the Horse/Priest Stone?). Have you ever been anywhere near them? YES, There only a very few people that have spent as much time as I have researching the history of the stone maps (I give huge credit to Azmula, Garry, and Larry). DON'T KNOW GARRY OR LARRY BUT AZMULA IS REALLY OUT THIER

Do you have ADD or ADHD?NO Do you have reading comprehension problems? NO Reread my posts and PLEASE quote me showing where I said that Travis had ever tried to sell the stones. NEVER SAID YOU DID, MUST BE READING COMPREHENSION PROBLEMS Go back to about 2006 and see what I have been saying about Travis Tumlinson. You might want to reread even my more recent posts. I have ALWAYS been one of a very few people that gave Travis T the benefits of any doubts, and I have NEVER called him a liar (spelled correctly). NO YOU SHADE IT BUY SAYING HE PLAYED WITH THEM AS A KID OR SOME OTHER JUNK I have only said that since I didn't personally know the man, I can't say for 100% certain that he didn't lie about anything he said. CAN YOU? YES See, when you are intellectually honest, unless you know something beyond a shadow of a doubt. YES (like Travis T's integrity), you have to admit the possibility of a lie. NO, HE FOUND THEM LIKE HE SAID If you don't admit the possibility, then you A. have some knowledge we don't, YES B. are deluded by what you hope, NO or C. just plain stupid. YES, BEEN CALLED THAT FROM TIME TO TIME, COMES WITH THE JOB

So in summation, before you try and smack talk me, you NEED to get your facts straight and keep your posts civil. THE POST WAS CIVIL,YOURS IS NOT It will save you from public humiliation and possibly pain. :oops: ;) I LOVE PAIN BORN IN TO IT, AND PULIC HUMILIATION IS NOT THIS,THAT WOULD COME ON THE DAY ALITTLE DUDE WHOOPS A BIG OLD FELLA LIKE YOU. OOPS!

Babymick1

Mike, Why all the hate, you know your suppose to watch your blood pressure! What weighs more a pound of gold or a pound of your rustle feathers

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Re: Are the stone Maps Authentic or are they a Hoax?

Post by gollum » Mon Jun 11, 2012 9:17 am

babymick1 wrote:
gollum wrote:
babymick1 wrote:Mike

The thing with your hole line of thinking is why would Travis haul the stones all the way from oregon to az just to give them a car wash. Not to sell them, Not to profit from them, Not to suck in investors, Just drive thier and then head back home. Makes no CENTS. Travis was a good man, thought maybe he found something good. Told the truth so people could call him a lier when he passed.
Wait that last thought makes only cents to you. He found them like he said.
So stop trash talking Travis.

Babymick1
Maybe you should learn to read before you direct any statements towards me. Did you personally know Travis Tumlinson? NO, DIED BEFORE I WAS BORN have personally spoken with his daughter. YES, I CALL HER MOM I have spoken with two other people that personally knew the Tumlinsons. YES, AND MANY MORE

I have personally held and was permitted to privately examine THE FAKE stone maps (see my avatar, does that look a little like the Horse/Priest Stone?). Have you ever been anywhere near them? YES, There only a very few people that have spent as much time as I have researching the history of the stone maps (I give huge credit to Azmula, Garry, and Larry). DON'T KNOW GARRY OR LARRY BUT AZMULA IS REALLY OUT THIER

Do you have ADD or ADHD?NO Do you have reading comprehension problems? NO Reread my posts and PLEASE quote me showing where I said that Travis had ever tried to sell the stones. NEVER SAID YOU DID, MUST BE READING COMPREHENSION PROBLEMS Go back to about 2006 and see what I have been saying about Travis Tumlinson. You might want to reread even my more recent posts. I have ALWAYS been one of a very few people that gave Travis T the benefits of any doubts, and I have NEVER called him a liar (spelled correctly). NO YOU SHADE IT BUY SAYING HE PLAYED WITH THEM AS A KID OR SOME OTHER JUNK I have only said that since I didn't personally know the man, I can't say for 100% certain that he didn't lie about anything he said. CAN YOU? YES See, when you are intellectually honest, unless you know something beyond a shadow of a doubt. YES (like Travis T's integrity), you have to admit the possibility of a lie. NO, HE FOUND THEM LIKE HE SAID If you don't admit the possibility, then you A. have some knowledge we don't, YES B. are deluded by what you hope, NO or C. just plain stupid. YES, BEEN CALLED THAT FROM TIME TO TIME, COMES WITH THE JOB

So in summation, before you try and smack talk me, you NEED to get your facts straight and keep your posts civil. THE POST WAS CIVIL,YOURS IS NOT It will save you from public humiliation and possibly pain. :oops: ;) I LOVE PAIN BORN IN TO IT, AND PULIC HUMILIATION IS NOT THIS,THAT WOULD COME ON THE DAY ALITTLE DUDE WHOOPS A BIG OLD FELLA LIKE YOU. OOPS!

Babymick1

Mike, Why all the hate, you know your suppose to watch your blood pressure! What weighs more a pound of gold or a pound of your rustle feathers

HAHAHAHA,

My blood pressure is just fine. And the rise was from you. See, when someone seems to take something like that so personally, they are many times personally involved. That's why I was a little rude (to see if you would out yourself). You did, but don't feel bad about it. So you are Janie's son? Just two questions:

1. Your dad's name?
2. What state does Janie live in?

If you can answer those two questions, then you are either who you say you are, or you have done some research yourself. If you would rather email or PM me the answers, that is just fine, because I know Janie didn't want her contact info shared.

Now back to the subject:

See, I asked Janie about Travis hoaxing the stone maps, and she told me:
[Me]
Report · 1:15am
Absolutely. There are a lot of people that claim that the stone maps are a hoax and Travis was part of it. I have always said that a person's actions speak volumes, and Travis' actions were not those of someone perpetrating a hoax, after all, he kept their existence mostly a secret from 1949 until he passed away in 1961.

[NAME DELETED]
Report · 1:17am
you're right he wasn't perpetrating a hoax and he did keep their existence pretty much a secret all that time.
See, the "name deleted" was Janie.

Scroll down this page and find my post about Travis (my real name is Mike McChesney):

http://www.thelostdutchmangoldmine.com/ ... 9&start=10

.......... and again here:

http://www.thelostdutchmangoldmine.com/ ... 5&start=10

You should really read that last thread from start to finish because it will tell you a lot (I know its 57 pages). But there are pictures from the cabin where Travis lived as a child of carvings he made way back then (in the 1920s).

So, before you give me any crap about casting aspersions at Travis, you might want to read a bit. You will easily see that I have ALWAYS been one of the few people that ever completely gave him the benefit of the doubt. ;)

................ and if you still want to step up to the plate sometime ..... no problem. I have ALWAYS believed in giving a man the chance to let his ass cash a check that his mouth wrote (or fingers in this case). The closest I've ever come to getting my ass whipped was when a friend of mine and I got in a barfight with Terry Gordy and Michael Hayes (Fabulous Freebirds) in about 1993. Even then, we gave as good as we got. We even wound up getting drunk with them after the fight. HAHAHA

Best- Mike

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Re: Are the stone Maps Authentic or are they a Hoax?

Post by gollum » Mon Jun 11, 2012 9:33 am

............. one more thing .............

You say I'm holding the fake H/P Stone. Are you saying that the Stone Maps in the Museum are not the real ones? Can you prove it?

Mike

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Re: Are the stone Maps Authentic or are they a Hoax?

Post by i-tsari-tsu-i » Mon Jun 11, 2012 9:53 am

Mike,

Lots of folks have been allowed to get up close and personal with the Stone Maps......for years now. I don't see why special equipment is needed to see things that are not visible to the naked eye, or a decent digital camera with good lighting. After all, whoever carved them did not use such equipment.

Image

Take care,

Joe

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Re: Are the stone Maps Authentic or are they a Hoax?

Post by gollum » Mon Jun 11, 2012 10:12 am

Joe,

Used to be, it would only cost you about $50 to get some private time with them. Lately, it seems more like an act of congress is needed. I think it's because Greg believes them to be authentic, while the AM&M Museum thinks they're hoaxes. Let me ask you Joe, of all the members of this forum, how many do you think have held the stone maps in their hands? Even at the AJ Photo Op Day, Greg only allowed Phil, Himself, one other guy, and me to handle them.

...... and actually, like I said in my previous post: I noticed that babymick1 was taking the Travis Integrity thing kind of personally. I just wanted to see if there was a personal connection he hadn't talked about, so I was a little rude and challenged him on a few things. It worked. He came out and said he was Janie's Son. He has yet to prove any of what he said, but that's where we are now. HAHAHAHAHA

Mike

i-tsari-tsu-i

Re: Are the stone Maps Authentic or are they a Hoax?

Post by i-tsari-tsu-i » Mon Jun 11, 2012 10:33 am

Mike,

We didn't have to pay, but I know others who have. I doubt many have held the heart......other than my wife and myself. I don't think Greg would allow it today.

Not many have their own photo's of the maps, but they were not hard to get to see and photograph. I do have the professional pictures, on CD, that were taken by the Museum. Believe I sent you a CD.

After all this time, I do tend to agree with the folks at the Arizona Mining and Mineral Museum. Like all of the other experts who have ever seen, had the time, knowledge and equipment to examine them
they have all agreed they were fakes......as far as I know.

The latest revelations from Garry seal the deal for me. Others will have another opinion, and that's just fine.

Take care,

Joe

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Re: Are the stone Maps Authentic or are they a Hoax?

Post by gollum » Mon Jun 11, 2012 11:08 am

Joe,

It's just like I said somewhere else;

Even after all the research and never before seen (at least publicly seen) material found by myself, Garry, and Larry since 2006, we are still in virtually the same place we were before any of the research was done. HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

I mean, we have put to rest a LOT of misconceptions that have been floating around about the Tumlinsons, the Mitchells, MOEL Corp, and Bob Corbin's involvement.

Regarding Travis making the stone maps; we have some family members saying one thing, and one saying something else. Remember, in Azmula's Email correspondences with Tumlinson family members, they say that Travis never went to the Supers or tried to unravel the maps, but we know from the Peck Letters, people close to the Tumlinsons give a completely different story. Travis was friends with Charlie Miller in AJ. He says different as well. So, why do you so implicitly trust the word of some anonymous Tumlinson Family Member? See, you put stock in it because it supports your belief. What would you be posting if that same anonymous family member had told Azmula that Travis had found the maps near AJ in the desert?

That is one CD you didn't send me. It's okay though. I have several hundred hi res pics from my time with them.

Mike

i-tsari-tsu-i

Re: Are the stone Maps Authentic or are they a Hoax?

Post by i-tsari-tsu-i » Mon Jun 11, 2012 11:28 am

Mike,

I have been working with the Stone Maps for over 40-years now. In that time, as I researched the story and the evidence that was available, my opinions have changed.

At this time, I am convinced that the Tumlinson story is pure fiction.
On the other hand, I am also convinced that the trail maps are accurate and start at Heiroglyphic Canyon and end in Little Boulder.

I believe, considering my time in the field, and time spent in research, that I'm entitled to an opinion on the topic. No longer care who thinks they have a better opinion or that mine holds no water.

I have yet to see a better solution from anyone, and I have seen a great many. If, after all your contacts and research, you find something of value, I will be the first one to offer congratulations to you. :)

Good luck,

Joe

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Re: Are the stone Maps Authentic or are they a Hoax?

Post by babymick1 » Mon Jun 11, 2012 12:11 pm

Mike,

I never said I was her son, I said I called her mom. So I never outted myself and right now I,m in Golden Valley AZ not far from Cali, Your neck of the woods. Now lets talk about important stuff. You got in a fight with the Fabulous freebirds, Awesome: Dad used to take us to All Star Wrestleing at Jamestown high school and I met all the greats, the Crusher, the Claw, Mad dog va-shawn, Dusty Rhoads, Scrap Iron kadasski and Vernon Gaugya and his son greg and the four horse men and the great Ric Flair and Audrea the giant what a hugh dude he was. This is where it all started.

Now to prove the stone maps you held where fakes,Plus the one,s at goldfield and the ones in the meuseum and the ones in ron feldmans office. The maps on the bumper of the car are the real ones. Down load the picture then zoom in on where the trail begins the arrow won,t be thier, it will be a 2 in its place. 231 triangle-lation.

That was you holding the h/p stone I thought it was some Ape arms. HaHaHa
And it was"nt me who felt thier trust was offened but I said I would talk to ya about it. "Travis found the maps like he said"

Babymick1

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