Edgar Cayce's reading on The Lost Dutchman Mine

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Jim Hatt

Edgar Cayce's reading on The Lost Dutchman Mine

Post by Jim Hatt » Fri Feb 19, 2010 11:01 pm

Here you go Guz... As you requested in another topic. Here is the complete Edgar Cayce reading on the Lost Dutchman Mine.

This is a subject I could go on and on about for a long time. I suspect that this topic will be long running so I will not try to fit all of my thoughts about it into the opening post.

The first thing that came to my mind when I read it was... Who was the reading done for? There are a few clues about that in Cayce's reading itself..

1 - it was done Feb. 1st, 1944.
2 - Who ever the reading was done for referred to Waltz as Walz.
3 - Who ever the reading was done for believed the LDM was an old Peralta Mine that had been previously owned by Pedro Peralta.
4 - Who ever the reading was done for knew about the Saguaro "Marker" (In Needle Canyon) with the four rocks stuck in it, BEFORE Thunder God's Gold was published, but is briefly mentioned (without any details about it's location) as a marker that Ruth was looking for, on page 98 of Trail of the Dutchman Published by Storm in 1939.

In my opinion. These things strongly point to Barry Storm as the person the reading was done for. Although... Erwin Ruth and Clay Worst could also be possibilities!

Notice that the statement in blue below was the information that was given to Cayce before he started his reading. Then when Cayce starts, (green text) there is a bit of hesitation by Cayce where he seems to be sensing something wrong with the information given to him, and makes excuses for things being different in his "Vision" from what was described to him before he started.

Also notice that Cayce never mentions Weaver's Needle or Needle Canyon by name. He just starts giving his directions from an "unspecified" marked cactus that is situated somewhere near the mine, but he never mentioned the manner in which the cactus he speaks of was marked.

Personally I see nothing in Cayce's reading that ties the LDM to the Weaver's Needle or Needle Canyon area, or Storm's Marked Cactus. Something did not fit when Cayce started his reading. But... nobody questioned him further about what it was, and he went on to describe the area surrounding the mine.

I will be interested in seeing if anyone else reads this the same way I do, and who they think the reading was done for.

Highlighting, Underlining and Bold Text done by me.
Jim



Edgar Cayce Readings, 3638-1
READING 3638-1
M 39

This Psychic Reading given by Edgar Cayce at the office of the Association, Arctic Crescent, Virginia Beach, Va., this 1st day of February, 1944, in accordance with request made by the self - Mr. [ 3638 ], new Associate Member of the Ass'n for Research & Enlightenment, Inc., recommended by Coronet.

Present: Edgar Cayce; Gertrude Cayce, Conductor; Gladys Davis, Steno. [ 3638 ] and Harmon Bro.
Time: 4:30 to 4:45 P. M. Eastern War Time. TEXT GC: You will have before you [ 3638 ] present in this room, and his enquiring mind, together with the gold mine discovered by Pedro Peralta and later worked by Jacob Walz know as "The << Dutchman>> ," in Pinal County, in the central portion of the State of Arizona. There you will find a high peak known as "La Sombrera" or "Weavers Needle". In Needle Canyon, a canyon running north from the base of the peak, you will find a large Saquaro cactus, marked, or that has been marked by four stones stuck into the trunk. From this marker, you will tell us exactly how far and in which direction to go to find the gold mine now known as "The << Dutchman>> ," describing in detail all landmarks from this marker leading directly to the mine. You will then answer the questions, as I ask them:

EC: Yes, we have the enquiring mind, [ 3638 ], present in this room; and those conditions that exist as legends and those as realities pertaining to the << lost>> mine or << Dutchman>> Mine.
In undertaking directions for locations of this from the present conditions, many things should be taken into consideration - as to whether descriptions would apply to those periods when this was put in the way of being hidden and/or those that would apply to the present day surroundings.
For time in its essence - while it is one, in space there has been made a great variation by the activities of the elements and the characters that have been in these areas.
For these are held as sacred grounds by groups who have, from period to period, changed the very face of the earth or the surroundings, for the very purpose of being misleading to those who might attempt to discover or to desecrate (to certain groups) those lands.

As we find, if we would locate this - from the present outlook:
We would go from the cactus marked here, in Canyon, some 5, 10, 20, 30, 37 1/2 yards to the north by west - north by west - to a place where, on the side of the hills, there is a white rock - almost pure white - almost as a triangle on top.
Turn from here - for you can't get over some of the ground going directly to the east - turn almost directly to the east, and just where there is crossing of the deep gulch, we will find the entrance to the Dutch Mine. This has been covered over, though to begin at the lower portion of the gulch we would find only about six feet before we would reach pay dirt in gold.
Ready for questions.
(Q) How rich is this vein?
(A) It's rich enough to work. About, at the present rate, five to six thousand dollars a ton.
(Q) Describe the type of ore.
(A) Impregnations with loose gold.
(Q) Is it covered over? If so, by what?
(A) Rock, very much like the surrounding country.
(Q) How deep is it from the surface?
(A) If from the surface, about eight to ten feet. If you want to get to it, commence at the lower edge of the Canyon and work under it - towards the east, see?
(Q) Give instructions for placing monuments and filing claim?
(A) That must be done from the material angle. Just so there's taken in enough to include all this area for about a thousand yards each way. [See 11/29/71 Newspaper Clipping in 3638-1, Par. R7.]
(Q) Give any further information about other mines in this group which may be helpful.
(A) We would give plenty of them here - the silver mine in the << Lost>> Sheep, which is over the hill on the other side towards the border, you see, that's the most valuable mine in Arizona.
We are through for the present.

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Re: Edgar Cayce's reading on The Lost Dutchman Mine

Post by oroblanco » Sat Feb 20, 2010 6:29 pm

Hola amigos,
Thank you Jim for posting this, I have never read Cayce's directions to find the mine, did discuss this with Joe R. and some other folks on another forum and he pointed out that if we follow Cayce's directions from the marked cactus, you are walking in air. I have to think that this must either be in error, or perhaps refers to a different marked cactus?

The reference to a rich silver mine lying to the south, towards the Mexican border - could it be referring to the Vekol mine of Doc Walker? Or perhaps farther afield, as in the rich silver mines of Tombstone? It is interesting, and I have to agree that the person most likely to have asked for this reading could be Barry Storm.

If there is anything to it, what about the mysterious direction to go,

"...in Canyon, some 5, 10, 20, 30, 37 1/2 yards to the north by west - north by west - to a place where, on the side of the hills, there is a white rock - almost pure white - almost as a triangle on top.


Was that Cayce trying to work out the distance? Or is it a riddle that needs to be worked out? I sure don't know the answers, and look forward to the views of others on this. Thank you in advance,
Roy

Jim Hatt

Re: Edgar Cayce's reading on The Lost Dutchman Mine

Post by Jim Hatt » Sat Feb 20, 2010 8:10 pm

oroblanco wrote:
Joe R. and some other folks on another forum and pointed out that if we follow Cayce's directions from the marked cactus, you are walking in air.
LOL, I believe it Roy. Some people would rather call Cayce wrong, than admit that they might be working off the wrong cactus. :mrgreen:

There is nothing in Cayce's statement that says the correct cactus is in Needle canyon. That was a presumption that was made by the person who asked for the reading. Did you not pick up on Cayce's hesitation when he began to speak? Something was not fitting with what he had been told. He did not know what was wrong, so he skipped over it, and went into describing the area around the mine as he was seeing it.

Cayce never even mentioned Weaver's Needle. Probably because it was too far away, from the area the mine is in, to even mention.

I would guess he was pacing off a distance in his mind when he ended with 37 1/2 yds.

Every time I see that 37 1/2 yds. in Cayce's reading. I think of the Ortiz letter which ends with... "35-40 meters from the end of the bottom". Just a coincidence I guess?

I don't know if Cayce was right or not. But just because his information did not work in one place where it was tried, does not mean it will not work when the mine is found.

Jim

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Re: Edgar Cayce's reading on The Lost Dutchman Mine

Post by oroblanco » Sat Feb 20, 2010 8:27 pm

HOLA Jim!

Re: the wrong marked cactus - this goes to show, some people tend to get "locked" in their beliefs when it comes to treasure hunting, and this seems to blind a fellow to other possibilities.

I did notice the hesitation you pointed out, which I take to indicate that what he was 'viewing' did not 'fit' with what he had been told to look for. That distance from Weavers needle, which traces all the way back to Bicknell's first article - I have to wonder about too. It seems that everyone just assumes the reference from Waltz which has been passed down as a "pointed peak" MUST refer to Weavers Needle, when really there are several other pointed peaks that may be what he was talking about, like Miners Needle for instance. Since I have not found the LDM I sure can't start measuring off the distances to see if they had it right, but in a way I think that is what will be done if the LDM does get found - it will be interesting to compare the real location with all the various clues that have been in circulation and see which ones were correct, which were plain wrong, and which may have been mis-understood. We know that Waltz spoke mostly German, so there is plenty of room for translation errors to creep in and all it takes is one word to be wrong, and no one can find the mine.

What do you think of the Ortiz map? Thank you in advance,
Roy

Jim Hatt

Re: Edgar Cayce's reading on The Lost Dutchman Mine

Post by Jim Hatt » Sat Feb 20, 2010 8:37 pm

I hear you Roy,

I have bitten by the act of locking into a belief many times. I learned the hard way that you have to take a few steps back, and try to look at things from any other possible angle before forming a conclusion. ie: Is it at all possible that I am working off the wrong cactus? :o

All I know about the Ortiz map is what was published in Helen Corbin's first book, and Bob Corbin telling me that what is in the book is exactly how it happened to be in his possession.

Note of clarification... The 37 1/2 half yards Cayce spoke of, was not the distance from a peak. It was the distance from the marked cactus to a white rock almost like a triangle on top.

Jim

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Re: Edgar Cayce's reading on The Lost Dutchman Mine

Post by oroblanco » Sat Feb 20, 2010 9:13 pm

Jim Hatt wrote
It was the distance from the marked cactus to a white rock almost like a triangle on top.
Hoo - good point and very easy to mis-interpret! Good catch!
Roy

Jim Hatt

Re: Edgar Cayce's reading on The Lost Dutchman Mine

Post by Jim Hatt » Sat Feb 20, 2010 9:49 pm

I have that part committed to memory Roy! :D

You wouldn't believe how many times I have paced off 37 1/2 paces from marked cactus looking for a white triangle. :lol:

Jim

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Re: Edgar Cayce's reading on The Lost Dutchman Mine

Post by Guz » Sat Feb 20, 2010 9:52 pm

What surprised me was how short the reading was. Did 3638 ever return for a second reading? notice He's referred to as 3638-1. There must be a registry key out there somewhere that would identify who got the reading. Privacy laws would not apply after all this time however I would not be surprised if the reg was redacted. Just speculation as I have no clue what Cayce did with his bookeeping. An interesting personality at the least though. So We have Cayce on record, any other psychics that have been involved that anyone knows of?


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Re: Edgar Cayce's reading on The Lost Dutchman Mine

Post by historybuff » Sun Feb 21, 2010 10:52 pm

Over the years of reading various books on Cayce, his readings and various articles about his prophecies. I know of no documented info that anyone ever profited from anything he was asked to reveal, from a horse race, to a stock purchase, to the LDM. Although his 'readings' were from the Akashic records which is the sum total of every living being, his actions, ect. there must be some 'block', as to using this info for materialistic profit. I do believe what Cayce said was true about the LDM .. but where is the question? :lol:
Bill

Jim Hatt

Re: Edgar Cayce's reading on The Lost Dutchman Mine

Post by Jim Hatt » Mon Feb 22, 2010 2:34 pm

historybuff,

Could the "Block" you refer to, be against future events that have not taken place yet, at the time of the reading?

Cayce gives some very specific details about the LDM, that had not been widely publicized in 1944. You can find all of his readings online. I found that one by Googling "Edgar Cayce" - and sub searching "Lost Dutchman" once I was in the Cayce website. Once I found that first reading, I didn't think about looking for any more... Duhhh

Jim

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