The Peralta-Fish Map

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Joe Ribaudo
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Re: The Peralta-Fish Map

Post by Joe Ribaudo » Wed Apr 05, 2017 5:51 pm

Choto wrote:
Joe Ribaudo wrote:Choto,

The obvious answer is to become the accepted expert on all things Dutchman. What follows will be the "expert's" book. :shock:

Good luck,

Joe Ribaudo
Joe,
Expert?
One can form an opinion (hopefully based on research) and package it for sale but I am not sure that anyone here can be considered an "expert". Some opinions certainly carry more weight than others but I think that has more to do with personal honesty, insightfullness and a selfless desire to advancing the general knowldge.

I can now write that you are correct about Miguel L. Peralta's geneology.

And more importantly, it seems as if there really is a geneological connection between Clay's Peraltas and Miguel L. Peralta y Vasquez

Absolutly fasinating.

I am going to put it out there for those of you reading this who are activly chasing after Jacob's lost mine. Don't let anyone discurage you from looking.

Its there.
Choto,

Some are, or can become, experts on the "history" surrounding all topics surrounding the LDM legend.

Good luck,

Joe Ribaudo

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Re: The Peralta-Fish Map

Post by jhowlett » Wed Apr 05, 2017 11:50 pm

Good posts on Peralta linage. Yes it is there, but even after revealed it will take work to put all the pieces together. JH

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Choto
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Re: The Peralta-Fish Map

Post by Choto » Thu Apr 06, 2017 6:24 am

jhowlett wrote:Good posts on Peralta linage. Yes it is there, but even after revealed it will take work to put all the pieces together. JH
jhowlett,
The best advice that I can offer (for what that's worth) is to contact the SMHS and to ask for a digital copy of the Peralta-Fish Map. I am not sure what they would charge but a small donation would certainly help offset the cost. I took my digital copy to Staples and had it printed to poster size for a few dollars more. Well worth it.

Black Top Mesa, Weaver's Needle, and the spot on (under?) Canyon Lake is where I would look.

And yes, once these old mines are discovered and that discovery shared with park officials, that's when the work begins. What an incredible moment that will be.

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Re: The Peralta-Fish Map

Post by Choto » Thu Apr 06, 2017 7:10 am

Joe Ribaudo wrote:
Choto wrote:
Joe Ribaudo wrote:Choto,

The obvious answer is to become the accepted expert on all things Dutchman. What follows will be the "expert's" book. :shock:

Good luck,

Joe Ribaudo
Joe,
Expert?
One can form an opinion (hopefully based on research) and package it for sale but I am not sure that anyone here can be considered an "expert". Some opinions certainly carry more weight than others but I think that has more to do with personal honesty, insightfullness and a selfless desire to advancing the general knowldge.

I can now write that you are correct about Miguel L. Peralta's geneology.

And more importantly, it seems as if there really is a geneological connection between Clay's Peraltas and Miguel L. Peralta y Vasquez

Absolutly fasinating.

I am going to put it out there for those of you reading this who are activly chasing after Jacob's lost mine. Don't let anyone discurage you from looking.

Its there.
Choto,

Some are, or can become, experts on the "history" surrounding all topics surrounding the LDM legend.

Good luck,

Joe Ribaudo
Joe,
I think that the best one can hope for is some type of deeper understanding. For example, I now know with some certainty that it was Miguel L. Peralta who, in 1859, found his brother Sacramento bleeding to death, horrible hacked with a machete. That moment would have stayed with Miguel influencing many of the decisions that he would go on to make. Some, not entirely honorable.

Contributing factors in his suicide for sure... alcohol, lead and guilt don't mix well.

Here is the article again for convenience:

MURDER NEAR SANTA BARBARA - Sacramento Peralta, a Sonorian, who had resided in California for the last ten years, was found murdered on the morning of the 17th of May, at Canada de las Llagas rancho of the "Dos Pueblos," distance from the town of Santa Barbara some nineteen miles. The body had been hewed and hacked by a machete in a horrible manner, having eleven gashes on the head and neck, and the fingers of one hand being nearly cut off. Miguel Peralta, who had been acting as vaquero along with the murdered man, who was his brother, had left him for about three-quarters of an hour, and when he returned found him expiring, covered with wounds. There had been no discovery of the murderer, but close investigation was being made. It is supposed that Sacramento Peralta was also robbed of $200.
Sacramento Daily Union 28 May 1859

Expertise is that carrot dangling from the end of a stick... always just out of reach.

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Re: The Peralta-Fish Map

Post by jhowlett » Thu Apr 06, 2017 7:20 am

Choto who is SMHS (Smithsonian Historical Society)? Thanks Jeff

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Re: The Peralta-Fish Map

Post by Choto » Thu Apr 06, 2017 7:51 am

jhowlett wrote:Choto who is SMHS (Smithsonian Historical Society)? Thanks Jeff
Sorry Jeff.
The Superstition Mountain Historical Society.
Actually, if you want to know what real treasure looks like stop by the museum and ask for George, Jim or Gregg D. I honestly can't say enough about these gentlemen.

http://superstitionmountainmuseum.org/

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Re: The Peralta-Fish Map

Post by jhowlett » Fri Apr 07, 2017 11:36 am

Hey Choto I just got off the phone with I believe it was Jeff at Superstation Mountain Museum and ask him about getting a digital copy of the Frank Fish Peralta map. He said he did not know about anything digital, but that he had a copy hanging up and we could picture of that. I said I was willing to pay, no comment from him. Tuff to take a picture from here. Kind of corn fused about how to get didga copy. Jeff

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Re: The Peralta-Fish Map

Post by Choto » Sat Apr 08, 2017 3:53 am

jhowlett wrote:Hey Choto I just got off the phone with I believe it was Jeff at Superstation Mountain Museum and ask him about getting a digital copy of the Frank Fish Peralta map. He said he did not know about anything digital, but that he had a copy hanging up and we could picture of that. I said I was willing to pay, no comment from him. Tuff to take a picture from here. Kind of corn fused about how to get didga copy. Jeff
Jeff,
I sent Greg an email last night and explained your conversation with the museum. The fault is mine for not coordinating with the museum staff. I am sorry for the confusion. Give it a few days and try again but hopefully Greg will post instructions here on how to properly request a copy.

I will burn a copy and send it to you myself if it doesn't happen thru the museum.

Again, I apologize.

Do you have a copy of Clay Worst's article titled THE SALAZAR SURVEY? If Matthew Roberts is correct, and he just may be, the Peralta-Fish Map is the same map that Cristobal Peralta showed to Perfecto Salazar in 1924. I have had some luck tracking down the extended Peralta family in Mexico and now have their genealogy back to Cristobal's grandfather.

My conclusion... Clay's article is essential reading.

Even more fascinating is the very real connection to Miguel L. Peralta y Vasquez... found in the Reavis-Peralta trial transcripts. 1000+ pages to comb thru but well worth the effort.

The mines are there.
Three on or under Canyon Lake, a handful on Blacktop Mesa, and at least one at the base of Weaver's.

Choto

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Re: The Peralta-Fish Map

Post by Choto » Sat Apr 08, 2017 4:09 am

Proof?
IMG_9278.jpg
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

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Re: The Peralta-Fish Map

Post by Choto » Tue Apr 11, 2017 4:47 am

I am re-reading TREASURE TALES OF THE SUPERSTITIONS by T.E. Glover and am trying to determine a possible date (year) for Waltz meeting and killing Mexican miners in the Superstitions. Any ideas? Glover shares that Waltz moved to Phoenix in 1869 so, it must have been sometime after that.

Once you begin looking at the genealogy of Miguel L. Peralta, it becomes clear that quite a few of his relatives resettled in the Phoenix area. I am trying to determine which, if any, Peralta family members were killed by Waltz.

Amazing to think that Waltz, Dr. Willing and Miguel L. Peralta were all at La Paz in 1862.

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