Enviromentalist vs Offroaders......

[MMM]

sal I and many like us have done what we can to have larger plates, but in the end, it is the officals in charge of lincensing who makes the hoice. That and so far I have seen nothing to indicate that having such plates will make any difference with the desire of those who want to make OHV use illegal. As I have said, I have seen very little, if any word for any wilderness group that even suggests they are concerened with the size of plates. All these groups (CBD, Sierra Club, SUWA, CWA, FNW, etc.) want is wilderness and no OHV use of any kind. Also it is impossable to have 100% compliance with all the OHV rules and regs out there by 100% of everyone. We do not live in a perfect world. I am NOT excussing anyone who breaks the laws and acts stupidly, but what percentage of drivers we se every day break driving laws? Do we suggest we close down freeways and roads because of the law breakers? NO Yet for some reason to the anti-OHV person any violation is to many and thus demands more closures. Where is the ballance?

Mike

[Sal]

nothing from nothing leaves nothing

[historik951]

I think this should sum it alllll up....

H

[Sal]

The issues have been defined. The necessary steps to achieve our goals have been outlined. Yet, as readers can plainly see, OHV riders are in denial and as a group refuse to step away from the status quo.

Though they rail at the injustice of "losing lands" to OHV use, to a man they cannot admit to one another that there is any way out of the morass other than condemning the motives of the environmental community.

nothing from nothing leaves nothing.

[MMM]

sal, so far the only thing you have reccomended is having larger plates for OHVs. I have seen zero idea beyond that. As you say "Nothing from nothing leaves nothing".

Mike

[Dan]

Yeah, that's right. Sal is fighting the issue for all of us, including OHV users. Anybody believe that?

"Environmental community"? How about "Angry Environmental Extremist Mob"?

The steps to achieve the goals of the environmental extremist mob have all been outlined, of course. The tactic of the closed-minded is to obstinately demand compliance with the impossible and ridiculous, which opens the door to demagoguery and distortion of reality when political enemies cannot achieve it. I just thought of that myself. Like it, Sal?

[Sal]

Sal is fighting the issue for all of us, including OHV users

OHV users are the ones who continue to lose ground due to illegal riding. If there was a way to identify the vehicle and owners could be held responsible for all actions done on the OHV, there would be a greater incentive for them to obey the laws protecting the desert environment. This is an instance where it would behoove legal riders to work WITH the environmental community.

[MMM]

sal you are the only person who is pushing hard for large IDs. Please show me ONE place where ANY anti-OHV, wilderness advocate groups have indicated any willingness of any kind if to stop or slow down the desire for wilderness/closed areas expansion due to all OHVs having big plates.

Mike

[Sal]

It just makes sense doesn't it Mike? If impacts of OHV's are limited to areas and routes approved for them, a big part of the reason for Wilderness is erased.

You may be aware of the fact that more and more people are becoming alert to the impacts of OHV's on public and private lands and are joining and contributing to PEER, CBD, Sierra Club, SUWA, COW, etc. These people are not interested in denying access to our heritage of wild lands. We are interested in protecting them from thoughtless waste.

Here's an article published by Responsible Trails America dealing with the issue of ID for OHV's:

Law enforcement, property owners, farmers, sportsmen call for national standard, more visible plates or decals
ARLINGTON, Va., April 13, 2011 /PRNewswire/ -- Responsible Trails America (RTA) today released a comprehensive study of visible identification requirements for off-road vehicles (ORVs) in all 50 states. The study found that visible identification is a common solution at the state level to the growing national problem of private property trespass, habitat damage and conflict with other outdoor users caused by a minority of reckless ORV riders.

In total, RTA identified 37 states that require some form of identification to be affixed to the vehicle. Of those states, 12 require plates or large decals. However, registration programs and state-to-state reciprocity vary widely.

ORV riders directly benefit from visible identification programs in 27 states that direct registration fees back to their trails. In 22 states, riders contribute to law enforcement to prevent reckless riding from leading to trail closures. In 26 states, riders contribute to trail maintenance to preserve legal riding areas and repair the damages caused by the minority of reckless riders.

RTA also assessed each state based on five categories that covered visible identification standards, ORV oversight and benefits of registration fees for riders. Five states (Arizona, Nevada, New Mexico, Pennsylvania and Vermont) received an A+ grade. Thirteen states received a grade of 0. Seventeen states received grades in the C range (70-79).

Based on the study, RTA offered three recommendations to assist law enforcement, land managers, private property owners and responsible riders in more easily and safely identifying illegal riders:

•A national visible identification standard.
•Visible identification should be in the form of a plate or large decal and font on the identification at least 3 inches tall.
•The ORV industry should standardize a location on the vehicle for mounting plates or decals, preferably on the front and rear.


These recommendations are supported by a diverse group including law enforcement officers, farmers, ranchers and sportsmen.

Frank Adams of the Nevada Sheriffs' and Chiefs' Association said, "Nevada Sheriffs' and Chiefs' Association worked closely with the Nevada OHV community to develop our current law and we believe that when fully implemented it will be very helpful in dealing with the problems of theft of OHVs and it will go a long way in identifying those who participate in destructive acts on or off public lands."

Christopher Henney, Director of Legislative Relations, Ohio Farm Bureau Federation, said, "Farmers as a group rarely tend to want more government regulation. But the growing problem of trespassing caused by illegal riders spurred our membership into action to pass common-sense visible identification and ORV enforcement measures. We are proud that we were able to work with rider groups to find a solution that all sides could agree to."

The Gonzales family, third generation property owners in Sante Fe County, New Mexico endured reckless ORV riders cutting their fences, chasing cattle and leaving debris all over their private property. "It doesn't matter whether it is a plate or decal, what is important is that the identification is visible," said property owner Eleanor Gonzales. "The police could have tracked down the illegal riders if we had been able to photograph the IDs on their vehicles. I think that would have made them think twice before breaking the law."

"It's frustrating having a hunt ruined by people riding ATVs where off-road vehicle use is prohibited," said Holly Endersby, a hunter from western Idaho. "Many ATVs look the same so there's no way to identify violators when reporting the incident to law enforcement. There should be a requirement that off-road vehicles used on public lands have license plates or large decals. Any ATV user who follows the law and land management directives on where they can and can not use these machines should have no objection to this type of identification."

Background Materials

Website - http://www.responsibletrails.org/Action ... eport.html

Full Study - http://www.responsibletrails.org/images ... report.pdf

State Report Card - http://www.responsibletrails.org/images ... echart.pdf

About Us

Responsible Trails America (RTA) is an independent research and advocacy project sponsored by the New Venture Fund, a charitable organization that also supports innovative public interest projects on global health, education and agriculture.

RTA works to give a voice to private property owners, sportsmen, ranchers, law enforcement officials, responsible ORV riders, and other outdoors users who support common-sense off-road vehicle law enforcement and management practices.

Learn more at http://www.responsibletrails.org or follow us on Twitter at http://twitter.com/RespTrailsAm.

http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases ... 58729.html

[MMM]

I would completely buy the idea of big plates if any of the wilderness groups would also agree that having said plates would in fact make a difference with their seemingly never ending quest for more and more wilderness areas. But in all honesty, I have not see this by anyone. Again I have zero problems with big plates or IDs. I ride in legal areas and wish everyone else did the same.

Mike