two kinds of Americans

[Sal]

"the civil war was not fought over slavery.." by Goldseeker

....In regard to most articles of the Constitution, the document is a word-for-word duplicate of the United States Constitution. The major differences between the two constitutions was the Confederacy's greater emphasis on the rights of individual member states, and an explicit support of slavery.


Slavery
The constitution forbade the practice of importing slaves from outside the Confederacy, but disallowed the national government from outlawing slavery in the following key provision:

No bill of attainder, ex post facto law, or law denying or impairing the right of property in negro slaves shall be passed [by Congress]
The constitution likewise prohibited the Confederate Congress from abolishing or limiting slavery in Confederate territories (unlike the United States, where, prior to the Dred Scott decision, Congress had prohibited slavery in some territories). The legal basis for slavery in the Confederacy is largely presented as an extension of property rights.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confederat ... nstitution

[Dan]

http://www.associatedcontent.com/articl ... l_war.html

Sal, I've lived in the northeast, and I've lived in the southeast. I've read, heard, and discussed this issue with teachers, lawyers, and laymen from both perspectives. And the primary reason for the Civil War was not slavery. This author is definitely not alone in his observations. Indeed, most politicians knew why the South was interested in seceding from the Union, and slavery was not the primary reason. To be sure, Sal, there was a difference of opinion on the issue, but slavery was not the primary issue driving a wedge between the two.

That is a myth perpetuated by grievance peddlers to show how boorish, racist, and insensitive the United States government supposedly was, and is today.

[Goldseeker]

"the civil war was not fought over slavery.." by Goldseeker

....In regard to most articles of the Constitution, the document is a word-for-word duplicate of the United States Constitution. The major differences between the two constitutions was the Confederacy's greater emphasis on the rights of individual member states, and an explicit support of slavery.


Slavery
The constitution forbade the practice of importing slaves from outside the Confederacy, but disallowed the national government from outlawing slavery in the following key provision:

No bill of attainder, ex post facto law, or law denying or impairing the right of property in negro slaves shall be passed [by Congress]
The constitution likewise prohibited the Confederate Congress from abolishing or limiting slavery in Confederate territories (unlike the United States, where, prior to the Dred Scott decision, Congress had prohibited slavery in some territories). The legal basis for slavery in the Confederacy is largely presented as an extension of property rights.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confederat ... nstitution

Sal, would you consider yourself a liberal? And BTW, wikipedia is very often wrong. Dont rely on them as a beacon of light, to illuminate the darkness inside your hollow cranium.

[Sal]

I think we can all agree that the outcome of the civil war was the abolishment of legal slavery.

[Pharo]

I think we can all agree that the outcome of the civil war was the abolishment of legal slavery.

Yes and I think we can all agree that your goal is the abolishment of off road activity.

Later,

PBiZ

[Dan]

I think we can all agree that the outcome of the civil war was the abolishment of legal slavery.

Not quite true, Sal. The Civil War began in 1861, as a direct result of the secession of the Confederacy. The secession was a result of grievances the southern states had against the US Government concerning economics, the exploitation of the south for its resources, labor, and markets, and slavery, among some other less visible issues. The Emancipation Proclamation was the act that abolished slavery, officially. It was created and signed in 1863 by Abraham Lincoln, a Republican. The Civil War did not end until 1865. At that time, the Confederacy was then obligated to once again obey the laws of the United States.

The issue of slavery has been distorted, and the myths surrounding slavery have been used to distort many other issues as well. It is to the advantage of some people to perpetuate those myths and distortions, including the belief that the Civil War was fought over slavery.

[Sal]

one kind of American uses double talk to confuse the issues that bother him even though in his heart he knows he's wrong.


Just like slavery defenders, these people look for legal loopholes and obscure precedents to try to convince the rest of us (and themselves) that they are not morally bankrupt.

As we celebrate Earth Day, let's celebrate a whole earth, one where natural silence and functioning ecosystems are there to perpetuate the continued existence of humans.

[Suzuki Phil]

Sal,

Since I have to work on Earth day I enjoyed a 100 mile blast on my dual sport motorcycle with some friends yesterday. It was beautiful in the desert. We stopped at the Mojave brewery near Ridgecrest for me some liquid refreshment (Orange Creme Soda for me, never ride and drink myself) and then back to camp.

Hope everyone can enjoy our Earth and public lands.

SP

[Suzuki Phil]

I think we can all agree that the outcome of the civil war was the abolishment of legal slavery.

Not quite true, Sal. The Civil War began in 1861, as a direct result of the secession of the Confederacy. The secession was a result of grievances the southern states had against the US Government concerning economics, the exploitation of the south for its resources, labor, and markets, and slavery, among some other less visible issues. The Emancipation Proclamation was the act that abolished slavery, officially. It was created and signed in 1863 by Abraham Lincoln, a Republican. The Civil War did not end until 1865. At that time, the Confederacy was then obligated to once again obey the laws of the United States.

The issue of slavery has been distorted, and the myths surrounding slavery have been used to distort many other issues as well. It is to the advantage of some people to perpetuate those myths and distortions, including the belief that the Civil War was fought over slavery.

I don't know all the facts about the civil war but I don't think was over slavery. Didn't Lincoln free the slaves just to piss of the south?

SP

[Goldseeker]

one kind of American uses double talk to confuse the issues that bother him even though in his heart he knows he's wrong.


Just like slavery defenders, these people look for legal loopholes and obscure precedents to try to convince the rest of us (and themselves) that they are not morally bankrupt.

As we celebrate Earth Day, let's celebrate a whole earth, one where natural silence and functioning ecosystems are there to perpetuate the continued existence of humans.

Earth Day is the flagship holiday for Liberals, Pagans, and Atheists. Count me out. Being Sunday it is the day for worship of God, Jesus, not worship of the earth, which was created by God. I do not worship the Earth. I bet Sal thinks Saul Alinsky was an ok guy too. Worship your earth day Sal, I went to church.